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seasonal affective disorder
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:12 pm    Post subject:  seasonal affective disorder Reply with quote

hey my impala friends, with the winter months here, i've been tired, sleeping alot, don't feel like doing much. doc said i prob have seasonal affective disorder since i don't feel any of this in the summer.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pu.....MH0002499/

i wanted your guys take on this, anyone ever heard of this? any of you feel this way in the dark winter months?

i guess its a form of winter depression, my doc wants to put me on paxil 10mg.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:53 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

PM sent.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:56 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

See that around here all the time, except they call it the..EI Blues..When ppl go back to work it goes away. Still it sucks to be down. If your having any kind of sex life, stay away from Paxil I've been told.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:20 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Been learning this in pyschology. Its actually very common.

There is a disorder for everything now... and there is also a pill for everything now. My advice would to stay away from the pills. Its just winter, you need to just do things that make you have and will occupy your time, be closer with family ect. Summer is almost here!

Also not saying your not having a problem, I just think such things can be easily overcome.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 1:43 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Use to live in Wisconsin, same thing happens here in Oregon where I live now. Dark, rainy and boring as hell. As crazy as it sounds I'd rather have snow so I could at least go snow runnin' in the impala. Best advice chief, tough up and don't touch any of those pills that the quacks peddle to people for their problems. Beer, video games and some skanks go a long way haha
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:03 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Doctors don't know shit except how to peddle for big pharma.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:21 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

madbrad wrote:
Doctors don't know shit except how to peddle for big pharma.


That might have been true in the past, but more and more institutions are implementing strict rules regarding compensation/perks for doctors in the US now. I work with a bunch of MDs and they aren't even allowed to keep pens from the drug companies... let alone go to dinners or attend trips.

That being said, I do believe that psychoactive drugs are over-prescribed, but to claim that doctors don't know anything other than how to write a prescription is just plain ignorant.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 30, 2013 11:22 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

i actually just bought one of those 10000 lux light Therapy Lamps, going to see if it works. i hear good things about it helping the s.a.d

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:32 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

A lot of it is lack of vitamins because you aren't out in the sun too.

Do you take a multi-vitamin?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 9:37 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

IffyG wrote:
to claim that doctors don't know anything other than how to write a prescription is just plain ignorant.


I don't think that's very nice calling me ignorant. It wasn't some off the cuff general quip. I said it out of knowledge. I wasn't referring to the kind of thing you were, about doctors pushing certain products for kickbacks or whatever. I was referring to something worse. Either way I don't see any call for that kind of talk in here. I did think you were a respectable, helpful member here.

What I meant was they aren't even trained to help us be healthy. They don't learn about that in med school. What they're trained to do is keep us unwell, and they do, even if they are well meaning. Prescibing a drug for just about anything is about as far as a typical visit goes, because of it. Pharma controls how medicine is taught. It controls all decisions being made by the CDC and the AMA, and congress. And they control the media. They are getting electronic cigarrettes banned because they aren't making any money off them, for example. Psychiatry with the help of pharma takes over any disorder it can to divert attention from the medical, physical maladies behind them. A drug is always prescribed, the underlying causes remain. It is exactly how they want it.
The therapy lamp(or the Sun) is a great way to get your vitamin D. Taking supplements of D is less efficient.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 9:57 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

^
Now that's some conspiracy s**t right there. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, we just need to keep it at a respectful debate. I for one feel the same way about the government. The same reason why there is no cure for cancer yet and that global warming is a lie. I believe the best thing to overcome stress or really anything is nature. Eat organic food or even foods without perservitives. Exercise, take vitamins. Like cod liver oil, garlic, peppers, anti imflametory pills. Talk groups, hobbys.

We are for sure in a pill taking society, ever since the 50s. It's been the cheapest, easiest way out of things. Even if a person who has panic attacks but stopped taking zanax, will still have one zanax with them where ever they go, for the security. And studies have shown that people who do that almost if not all defeat panic attacks. It's all in the brain.

But there are for sure good medicines and good doctors, it's just that is taught to them isn't always correct. God... I'm starting to talk like my mom lmao.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:04 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

If that was what you meant, you should have been more clear. I still stand by my response to your initial statement.

madbrad wrote:
IffyG wrote:
to claim that doctors don't know anything other than how to write a prescription is just plain ignorant.


I don't think that's very nice calling me ignorant. It wasn't some off the cuff general quip. I said it out of knowledge. I wasn't referring to the kind of thing you were, about doctors pushing certain products for kickbacks or whatever. I was referring to something worse. Either way I don't see any call for that kind of talk in here. I did think you were a respectable, helpful member here.

What I meant was they aren't even trained to help us be healthy. They don't learn about that in med school. What they're trained to do is keep us unwell, and they do, even if they are well meaning. Prescibing a drug for just about anything is about as far as a typical visit goes, because of it. Pharma controls how medicine is taught. It controls all decisions being made by the CDC and the AMA, and congress. And they control the media. They are getting electronic cigarrettes banned because they aren't making any money off them, for example. Psychiatry with the help of pharma takes over any disorder it can to divert attention from the medical, physical maladies behind them. A drug is always prescribed, the underlying causes remain. It is exactly how they want it.
The therapy lamp(or the Sun) is a great way to get your vitamin D. Taking supplements of D is less efficient.


Have you sat through any medical school courses? I had to take the first two years of didactic coursework for my PhD program and I can tell you unequivocally that more time was spent on health and wellness than I thought was necessary. Out of 20 hours of class a week at least 3 directly related to nutrition, preventative medicine and early interventions to avoid use of pharmaceutical therapy.

As far the as the prescriptions being about as far as a visit goes, you can thank the general public that has created a culture where doctors know everything and can do no wrong. If more people advocated for themselves in the clinical setting a lot of those prescriptions would be eliminated. I for one take pleasure in making MDs squirm when I speak their language and make it clear I have a hand in my medical care.

While I would agree that many psychiatric conditions are being over-treated with pharmaceuticals (ADHD comes to mind immediately), there is a rapidly growing body of evidence that neuro-chemical abnormalities underlie many psychiatric conditions. Since you seem to be an advocate for fixing the "medical physical maladies" underlying psychatric disease how do you propose treating schizophrenia? ADHD? Bipolar disorder? Sadly, until gene therapy becomes an approved thereapeutic method, the pills are the best thing we have available. Trust me, there are thousands of scientists who aren't in the pocket of big pharma trying to work these solutions out.

As far as the Vitamin D and seasonal affective disorders is concerned, there is not a consensus among the scientific literature. It's a classic case of correlation does not equal causation. The well designed epidemiological studies on the subject concede that the decrased vitamin D levels may be the result of changes in lifestyle due to depression (less time outside, decreased physical activity and altered diet). While I don't disagree that light therapy is effective in treating SAD, I do believe there is strong contribution of the placebo effect in play.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2013 11:49 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

I'm only saying that many of these neurological disorders aren't psychiatric. They've been "claimed" by Psychiatry. They are really medical. Yes you are right, many scientists not in pharma's pocket look for solutions. Pharma also does research, blatant conflict of interest, of course getting the results they want, no one can see what they are doing with the data, and has the power to push that to the forefront, and pushing all else to the fringe, and has the power to influence the doctors. There are plenty of Pharma executives that hold decision making seats at the CDC, FDA, AMA, AAP etc. There's little official acknowlegement of the gut-brain connection. Just an example. It does not serve Pharma to acknowledge it. Thousands of people successfuly treat the gut issues with biomedial and diet intervention, with improvents and even elimination of all manner of neurologial(and non neurological, such as Krohn's and Celiac) issues, including but not limited to the examples you used. I'm just saying, Ignorant, is kind of mean.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 12:20 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Psychiatry is a sub-discipline of medicine. I don't see how you can differentiate the two.

How is big pharma doing research a conflict of interest? That's like saying an elecronics company can't develop new technologies because its a conflict of interest. The problem isn't the drug companies doing research, it's the shady behind the curtain dealings that once permeated the field. Pharma execs do not hold decision making positions in the FDA, CDC etc. Rather they used to pay off doctors to push through drugs. In addition the affordable health care act requires public disclosure of all payments to physicians from drug companies. Several states already had this requirement and payments to physicians dropped dramatically when such requirements are in place. With this reporting required by law, the ability for big pharma to influence decision making on that level will be limited dramatically.

There is a large body of literature that relates gut-brain problems in autism. In addition here is an abstract for a recently published paper that discusses such a connection (the title also serves to illustrate how a non-scientist would never be able to find such studies and believe that the gut-brain connection is being ignored). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21876150 . It's a dense read, but it indicates that eating a specific probiotic can alter brain function.

I'm not advocating pills for everyone. I do agree that many things can (and should) be treated with non pharmaceutical methods. Ultimately, the burden falls on a the patient to do some research and decide if they want to pop a pill for mild depression or slightly elevated cholesterol when there are alternative therapies that can attain the same clinical end point available to them.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 1:03 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Interesting debate. It is interesting to see both sides of the argument here, and there is probably some truth to both. I do think that the approach of 'its all in your head' and writing off the usefulness of medications is shortsighted and not fully informed.

I've experienced serious depression and it is difficult to manage on a scale that I won't even try to explain. I've read and heard people say that those with psychological issues should just 'get over it' or 'man up'. A chemical imbalance isn't something you 'man up' to get past. It can require treatments, whatever type that may suit the patient.

While madbrad does have a valid view drug companies doing research have a hand in directing information outward, and yes their first instinct is going to be making a profit, not making everyone healthy. Not to say that they're specifically making us unhealthy, but they may be treating symptoms and not causes. This is true with drugs like Paxil: they aid in balancing brain chemistry and reducing or eliminating depression. That is not a permanent solution and shouldn't be inferred as such: it doesn't promote the body to balance it's chemistry permanently: it simply does so for a period of time.

Iffy also has makes valid points and I'm not fully taking either side. Doctors may seem like pill pushers, but it also depends on who you choose to treat you. In Canada there is a fine selection of alternative treatment doctors available who opt to treat via diet, non-medicinal products, physical treatments, etc. Even a regular doctor can opt to not prescribe drugs and instead suggest alternative treatments - it's more about choosing your healthcare provider instead of looking at them all as a guy in a white coat / dress shirt and tie.

Additionally, as a closing thought; I believe the brain can be a powerful tool in 'treating' various illnesses, even if it is via placebo effect / positive thought, etc. Rest assured that while positive thinking has it's place, it is not going to cure everything, and it's never going to be backed by any kind of guarantee.

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