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Service Traction System Error
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Frank3
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 6:15 pm    Post subject: Question Service Traction System Error Reply with quote

My 2001Impala LS started displaying a whole round of error messages on the dash this week. What we have on the dash in the information message center is 'Service Traction System' and we have the 'Trac Off' and 'ABS' indicator lights also lit on the cluster. We went to have it scanned at the local autoparts store and what came back was 'B1218 - ABS Pump Motor Circuit short to voltage or Motor Ground is open' and 'B1245 - Low Tire Pressure'. Where do I start on this one? Any common or repeating problems involving these error codes? 2 years ago we had to replace the BCM because it was reporting multiple errors. One was horn circuit shorted to +12V, a tire inflation error and the last involved the Theft Deterrent System. The dealer initially charged us to 'reseat' the horn relay and horn wiring harness. I went through my service manual and found that all 3 systems originate from the BCM. When I went back, told the dealer about this and asked them to check the BCM. The dealer did a more thorough job and said when we locked the car with the remote it chirped the horn as it armed the theft det system. Could I be looking at another bad BCM? Sad
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Pitch Black SS
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2004 Chevrolet Impala
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 6:44 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

usually when the trac and abs lights come on at the same time, its a problem with one of the wheel sensors. The entire hub needs to be replaced. Some people found that the sensor was good, but the wiring behind it became corroded. They cleaned it up and it solved the problem

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Frank3
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 6:49 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Pitch Black SS wrote:
usually when the trac and abs lights come on at the same time, its a problem with one of the wheel sensors. The entire hub needs to be replaced. Some people found that the sensor was good, but the wiring behind it became corroded. They cleaned it up and it solved the problem

Thanks Pitch Black SS, I was thinking the same thing at first, but when the scanner didn't report any bad wheel sensors I dismissed it. Any way to determine which wheel sensor could be the problem one?
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Pitch Black SS
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 7:31 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

A good scanner should be able to tell you exactly which is at fault.

However, with the codes you are throwing, there may be other issues. Sorry Im not familiar with them.

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Irish_alley
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 08, 2011 9:34 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

autoparts stores usually use the cheap obd2 readers thats all they read not abs. im surprised they got the codes they got. but i have the same problem but mine was only when its raining and usually happens when there was just a hint of tire slip. i had a bad wheel bearing thought it was the right side changed it with a new one only to find out it was the left. so i changed the left side with the old "good" one i took off the left. fixed it. then next time it rained i got this message also. so as bb said check your connection im almost sure thats my problem. the wheel sensor to my knowledge which senses the speed of each tire for abs and trac.. also i noticed when my goes off it also screws up my mpg display in my d.i.c.

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Last edited by Irish_alley on Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:27 am; edited 1 time in total
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Graves
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 9:45 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Hey i know somthing about this. My 01 had the same problem. i replaced the front wheel hubs and the lights all went away but a few weeks later they all lit up again. So I did some reading and it turns out on early impalas the wiring harnes to the hubs go bad. There is a TSB out there for this.

Bulletin 03-05-25-008 overview:
GM front wheel speed sensor harness replacement - 2001-2003 Buick Century, Regal; 2001-2003 Chevrolet Impala, Monte Carlo; 2001-2002 Oldsmobile Intrigue; 2001-2004 Pontiac Grand Prix
This bulletin is about inspecting the harness going to the front wheel speed sensor for wear from contact with front suspension parts.
Repair harnesses/leads are available that can be spiced onto the main harness.
2001-2003 impala & Monte Carlo Right side - 10340313
2001-2003 impala & Monte Carlo Left side - 10340314

Or You can do as i did cut the harness off just before it goes into the main harness and solder in new wires water proof and reconnect .
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Arvetus
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:20 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Yeah, what Graves said...
I had the dealer read my codes and they told me the passenger front wheel hub was bad. I ended up replacing both sides myself and still did not cure the problem. Turns out it was the harness itself, not the hub. So I replaced the hubs for nothing Sad oh well...

So, check out the harnesses REALLY well before you go replacing hubs... It is likely one or the other though.

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hailster
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 10:25 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Like Graves said, it could be an issue with the wiring. One of my wires was broken roughly 3-6 inches from the hub. Since the wire broke the wire ended up getting very corroded. I had two options, go back far enough and find good wire or clean up the corroded wire. I went back almost 12 inches and the wire was still corroded, so I ended up cleaning the wire and then soldered a new piece of wire in.

This picture was taken on my passenger side. the wire was pulled up from the original position for the picture. I should have checked the drivers side but haven't yet. After fixing the wire the traction and abs lights turned off.



For a bigger version go to http://kc9fsh.com/naioa/traction-wiring.jpg

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Frank3
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:45 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

This problem is just plain wierd! I drove all the way into work this morning, 18 miles in all about 8 miles on backroads and about 10 on the interstate. Not a single error on the dash. I expected something to light up as I went around a rotary corkscrew entrance to the parking garage - but nothing. When I got out of work, I didn't touch the wheel and before the dash did its bulb check, I had the service traction system along with Traction off and ABS lights. I drove straight to the same autoparts dealer where they put the ABS scanner they have on it. Same codes, 1218 and 1245. I read the hints and suggestions everyone kindly put in, thank You! Very Happy and threw the car up on ramps and checked out the wiring. I unplugged each connector, looked for water and contamination, then followed the harness back to where it crosses the frame rail. I split the protective sleeve looking at the wires, they looked in good shape. I even pulled them lengthwise to see if the conductor inside was broken allowing the insulator to stretch. I then did the same on the other side. That looked good too!. I did notice while under there that on the left hand control arm, that the front rubber mount has broken loose and the control arm is right next to the cradle, but that's another repair for another thread.
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Arvetus
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 10:13 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Frank3 wrote:
I did notice while under there that on the left hand control arm, that the front rubber mount has broken loose and the control arm is right next to the cradle, but that's another repair for another thread.


GET THAT FIXED NOW!
If you don't you will wind up having to replace the subframe/engine cradle. Unless you're handy with welding aluminum, which is a real pain when it is not squeaky clean.

Regarding the harness going out to the wheels, you may have have some broken copper strands inside the insulation that you will never see. It is probably more likely on the passenger side since it seems to be stretched a little tighter on that side for some reason. The good thing about cutting and splicing the harness in is that you can leave a little extra slack in the pigtail. Also, the connector itself may be going bad, so you may never see it.

I always had problems when it was damp out in the early mornings or if it was raining/snowing. If it was perfectly dry, I would seldom have an issue.

I believe when I got the harnesses from ZSPOT, they were about $50 for the pair.

I don't think that the harness is any different between the two sides, only the length of wire you get with it. I am sure I have a driver side harness lying around somewhere...

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Frank3
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 11:48 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Thanks for the info Arvetus. I knew it was important to take care of that, but figured I had a couple weeks to get it done. I just got the lower control arms ordered, they come with the ball joints and bushings installed already. I figure that if I do one I need to get it aligned, SO.. I might as well do both while I'm at it. I also have the harnesses for the ABS sensors ordered. Should make for an interesting day.
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Frank3
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 9:07 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Graves, thanks for the info on the harnesses. I was able to give the part numbers directly to the dealer to order.
While looking in the service manual last night on the lower control arm replacement, I noticed several items that would give me problems, 1 - the ball joint torque. It says to tighten to 15 ft-lbs + 120 degrees. How do you get a torque wrench in there to get the initial 15 ft-lbs of torque? 2 - on the sway bar ends, it was really confusing about aligning a 'flat' in a certain position then moving another part of the bushing to 20 degrees of the centerline? of the control arm. This is really confusing! Anyone ever take apart the sway bar links?
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Frank3
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 12:02 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Well I got both control arms installed. WHEW! I'm glad I asked about the bushing right after I saw it. When I took the old control arm out, the metal flange around the rubber bushing was starting to gouge the mounting point. Not all the way around but possibly about 1/2 to 2/3 of the circumference. The place where it is the worst is on the front-most side of the bushing facing the front of the car. When I finish the ABS harness, I'm going to bring it in for an alignment and have them take a look at it. What do you think about it? [url][/url]
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Arvetus
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 4:31 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Good!
Here's what mine looked like after I let it go for a couple months... and why I told you to get it fixed now! Smile


and that is what eventually ended up being the straw that broke the camels back and drove me to just get another vehicle. Not only did I have to get that taken care of, it was bad enough to the point of I would have had to replace the engine cradle, but I had struts that needed to be done, plus I could never track down my battery drain issue, so I just got me the Tahoe Smile

An aluminum cradle from a salvage yard around here was in the $300 range, + labor to put it in (I don't have the equip to do that), + control arm + struts + alignment, and still having to put up with battery drain = not worth it. Smile

Glad you got that fixed sooner than I noticed mine!!

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Frank3
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 15, 2011 10:05 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Arvetus, I see what you mean. What a shame! I was told by someone at the dealer that the rear rubber mount takes most of the weight and the front one is mainly used for stability. So maybe mine will hold up OK, what do you think?. The right hand side was separated about 1/2 way around and would have started the same thing soon enough. I plan to tackle the harnesses as soon as it stops raining here. As for this rubber bushing issue, maybe it ought to be a sticky or a notice to other members won't be subject to damages like this and have to get extensive work done.
As for your former battery drain issue, I had that problem with my Tahoe. It kept draining the battery down and it wasn't until the last visit, when I went to bring it to the dealer that it had a stone dead battery in the morning. After I got it started with one of those portable hand carried boosters and got about a mile or so from my house, did I notice the odometer was all 0000000's. When I got to the dealer it had about 4 miles on the clock. I told him what happened and he blamed me for shorting something out or causing a surge that took out the cluster. I told him if you have a dead battery and another electrical failure such as all zeros in the cluster, then chances are that the bad cluster which caused the zeros also caused the dead battery. After 3 1/2 weeks when I went to get my truck back, the dealer admitted it was the cluster that caused it. He said Detroit told him they have some clusters that have elevated current draw and that I did some good detective work. He even asked if I wanted a job in his service department!
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