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Only Starts when..... SOLVED!!!
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Maximus96792
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 2:23 pm    Post subject: Snif ! Only Starts when..... SOLVED!!! Reply with quote

I bypass the starter.

My 2005 Impala wont start unless I Use a screwdriver to the Starter. Im wondering if my passlock system has failed.

My question is should I pop the dash, while the car is running, and snip the yellow passlock wire? I read a write up that says I might get the security light, but wont be stranded, unable to start. I never want to go through this again, and like I said a security light flash wont be too bad. Much better than Popping the hood.. I also tried the 11 min wait/ 30 sec. off 4 th time will start technique to no avail.
I NEED HELP! Or should I just turn the alarm off through the radio?

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I read this below on Fixya.com:
The most common cause of this problem on the Impalas is their @$!@ security system called Passlock or Passlock II. It is very sensitive and senses an intrusion a lot of times even when there is not one. When it does it locks down the fuel injectors. You can leave the key in the ignition in the on position and wait 10 minutes for it to re-set but it tends to do this 4-5 times a month at a minimum. The way to permanently solve this is to disable this portion of the system.
You will need to take the dash off ( it is not as hard as it seems) It is held in place with a variety of bolts, screws, and clips. You can do a web search for dash removal to try and find the exact configuration. Once the dash is out under the steering column there is a metal plate. It needs to come out also (held in place by a few bolts. Once this is removed you will have clear access to the underneath part of the steering column. Coming up the steering column you will see (3) wires grouped together. (Yellow, Black, and White). They will either be tied or taped together. The only one you need to concern yourself with is the yellow one. This is the most important step. (1) Start the car! (2) While the car is started snip the yellow wire, making sure it does not contact any metal. (3) using electrical tape or something similar cap off the ends and tie it off if you wish. (4) Turn off the car, put the plate back on, the dash back together and problem solved!. The yellow or orange security light will stay permanently illuminated, but it is not a problem. I did this on my Impala which I inherited 10 months ago and have never had this problem again. You can take the bulb out of the instrument cluster to for the security light but it is a lot of trouble and not worth the effort. Hope this helps..



_______________________________________________________


OKAY problem solved..... after tracing all harness wires, In the filter Box is a thingy for the computer. A Rat had made it his/her home. 4 wires were shredded. After some snipping and Heat shrink, She stars Right Up.
Cheers to the fella above who mentioned that had the problem been the Passlock I would get a crank but no start. Kinda Told me that The pass Lock or Key Issue was not a factor. So again, Rat in the Filter Box. Bumper is off due to repairs. PROBLEM Solved. Thanks Everyone. Aloha! Cool Cool


Last edited by Maximus96792 on Mon Jan 25, 2010 10:58 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Fallguy
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:41 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Service manual speaks of a crank relay in the junction box under hood. You might want to replace and see what happens unless this is an expensive relay?

I read a 30 min (3x30) relearn in the book.

The 10 min relearn requires a dealer computer to be in sync with the care for that proceedure if I understand it correclty.

30 min relearn is basically this.

Put key in and turn to on position, let set this way approx 10 minutes until sequrity light goes out, then turn to the off position for a short rest (approx 5sec.)

Do this 3 times. Make sure after last time you back to off dont just go immediately to start. After the third wait in run position go back to off for a bit before trying to start.

Good luck

P.S. are you getting a security warning on your dash, does starter even click once?


Last edited by Fallguy on Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:54 pm; edited 3 times in total
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bbengineer
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:51 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

If you cut the yellow wire you WILL get the Security emblem in the cluster message center. It won't flash, it will stay on. I am not sure you will pass inspection (if you have one) with the security light lit

Your best bet is to actually fix the problem.

Start by trying another key... when the key gets too worn, it causes issues. If you don't have a non-worn key, have the dealer cut you one from your VIN

You might want to then take apart your ignition switch and clean the contacts. Marginal ignition switches tend to behave worse in the winter due to less moisture in the air

If that doesn't solve it, replace the Passlock sensor in the ignition cylinder and then do the security relearn.

You could also bypass Passlock using the resistor method if you don't want to replace the sensor (info here: http://www.automotiveforums.co.....ock+bypass )

I'd be extremely surprised if it was the crank relay...

BBEngineer

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Maximus96792
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 9:17 pm    Post subject: Beark ! only starts when Reply with quote

Thanks fellas. At least I have a direction to go in now. I tried swapping the relays, No help, and this is just so friken frustrating.
What if the starter is faulty? When I crank it theres no noise, all the dash cuts off. Damm I wish I knew what to do.



Would it Hurt if I made a Toggle switch to do the bypass? Basically ignition on and the i press a button to start?
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Rollie73
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 9:46 pm    Post subject: Beark ! Re: only starts when Reply with quote

Maximus96792 wrote:




Would it Hurt if I made a Toggle switch to do the bypass? Basically ignition on and the i press a button to start?


That will probably work but you really should try the steps that BBE laid out for you first.

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Fallguy
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2010 11:41 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Give BBE advice a try to be sure as this should cost little and could fix you right up, from what I read he is a senior experienced administrator and has worked with many things.

Per what I read in the service manual the crank relay (one replaced) will make an audible click noise.

Have someone listen to the crank relay (not that it is bad) but you can see (hear) if it is even getting turned on via the click noise. From this you would know if it is even getting signal (voltage) up to that point.

No click at crank relay ("crank relay", not starter) and your probably into something at the key switch area or passlock ??

Click heard at the "crank relay" and you may have starter or cabling issues beyond your ignition??

Good Luck.

Have also read in service manual that the solenoid of the starter can short out to ground (dead short or one with some resistance??). If your "crank relay" clicks the starter is at least likely being at least fed voltage (fuse could possibley be blown though). If it is really drawing down your lighting starter may have developed a short in the solenoid?
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:38 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Passlock does not disable the starter.
When the key is turned, the BCM checks for the correct resistance on the passlock circuit. If the resistance is wrong, the fuel injectors are disabled. The car will crank all day, but never fire. The security light will also flash if the BCM disables the injectors.

BTW, I did the passlock bypass 3 years ago, the directions BBE posted work perfectly. You will have a constant security light, however.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 12:52 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Actually... if passlock fails, it does lock out the starter (actually the crank relay)

Quote:
The PCM communicates with the BCM over the Class 2 serial data line. When the BCM determines an incorrect password, it sends a Class 2 serial data password to the PCM in order to disable the crank relay and fuel injection system. If the BCM receives the expected voltage from the Passlockô sensor, the BCM sends a class 2 serial data password to the PCM in order to enable the crank relay and fuel injection system. The PCM then allows the vehicle to start normally.


You shouldn't have a constant security light if you got the resistance correct (or did you just cut the yellow wire)?

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Frank
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:36 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Jayme wrote:
Passlock does not disable the starter.


Passlock does indeed disable the starter. However, if you aren't getting a security light when your car isn't turning over, then it isn't a Passlock issue...

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 9:54 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

I had the same problem on my 01'. I found some loose ground wires in the engine compartment so I went around and tightened all the grounds I could find and have not had a issue since. Hope this helps.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:09 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Im going to the dealer today to see if a new Key Fixes this issue.
When I try to start the car, Dash goes blank, Everything cuts off.
Battery is fine because I can Bypass the starter and she will start.

I really hope its just the key!

---------------------------------------------------

20 mins later: Just got off the phone with the dealer, he says the Key will likely be a waste of time. He suggests going for the Passlock Bypass. I will consult my friend.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 3:53 pm    Post subject:   Reply with quote

I highly doubt it's a Passlock issue...more than likely it's the ignition switch, like bbengineer mentioned.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:00 pm    Post subject: Great ! Solved Reply with quote

OKAY problem solved..... after tracing all harness wires, In the filter Box is a thingy for the computer. A Rat had made it his/her home. 4 wires were shredded. After some snipping and Heat shrink, She stars Right Up.
Cheers to the fella above who mentioned that had the problem been the Passlock I would get a crank but no start. Kinda Told me that The pass Lock or Key Issue was not a factor. So again, Rat in the Filter Box. Bumper is off due to repairs. PROBLEM Solved. Thanks Everyone. Aloha!
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Inferno03LS
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:44 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

did you find the rat?
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:50 am    Post subject:   Reply with quote

Inferno03LS wrote:
did you find the rat?


Or keep the nest?

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